QA on Clinically Relevant HerbDrug Interactions
Ms thanks a lot bill for that great talk.I'm interested in the piperine example you gave just because it's the most common thing people have on their, everyone has piperine on their table, right dr gurley right.Ms so what is the typical dose that would be required to elicit that effect and how relevant is that to the amount that most people consume Gurley it's a great question.And the fact that you, if you're like me, i'm a pepper freak i love black pepper as well as crushed red pepper.
But the amount of black pepper that you just put on your food to season it, is not enough piperine in there to do anything.We're talking about concentrated extracts of piperine where you're looking at in the neighborhood of usually north of 100 milligrams of pure piperine to elicit some of these.Most of the piperine that's added to some of these, there is actually a product called bioperine that has i think the piperine concentration is around 250 milligrams, so it's a pretty whopping dose.The amount of piperine that's just in black pepper,.
Spreading it on your food, minuscule.So that's probably not an issue.But the issue is some of these extracts of black pepper and piper longum that are found in a lot of multi component supplements.That was a great question. Josephine briggs great talk, really enjoyed it.So tell us a little more about this use of goldenseal to mask urine screening.I didn't follow that story.Laughter Gurley that was brought to my attention by some folks and so i started looking into the literature and yes,.
There's actually quite a bit, i wouldn't say quite a bit, you can actually find some articles on that.And so exactly why goldenseal, well, if you look at it, depending upon whether or not a lot of the opioids are involved.A lot of opioids have to be metabolized by 2d6 to be active.And so if you can inhibit that with goldenseal then that may be a good thing.But it also might be a bad thing because it may actually if it's a pro drug or not a pro drug it depends upon if you inhibit the.
Pro drug then that may be a good thing, you might mask it.It depends on whether or not some of the opioids are metabolized by 2d6 to active components or whether they're not.And so by inhibiting 2d6 that can either make some of these more easy to detect or some less easy to detect.That's the mechanism. Shurtleff one more question. Sorkin hi, bill.Barbara sorkin from ods.Great talk, thanks.I was thinking, wondering if we could switch gears a little bit and talk about component interactions within specific.
Botanicals and thinking about the potential for different effects of caffeine within coffee versus guarana versus yerba mat.And what about caffeine in energy drinks Gurley that's a great question.I've actually been working on a large, a fairly exhaustive review on caffeine containing dietary supplements that it's not quite ready yet, but it's getting there.But if you start it's a great question because if you delve into the literature most of the, at least the, i like to use the ephedra free supplements because they offer a great example for how other phytochemicals can potentiate.
The activity of caffeine.And we talked about the catechins which are present and that's kind of a, i don't know if it's a no brainer, but it's something that is certainly there.But a lot of, say for situations there's a lot of products that use coleus forskohlii or forskolin which can certainly potentiate the activity of caffeine because it stimulates adenylate cyclase and it stimulates the production of cyclic amp and if you get into all the g protein coupled stuff that can certainly increase its activity.The incorporation of yohimbe and yohimbine,.
Again caffeine and yohimbine being a bad combination.And then even with red pepper or capsaicin, some of the capsaicinoids can actually have some pro.They can stimulate cardiac activity.And so when you've got caffeine by itself it is pretty innocuous but when you start looking at it in terms of other components that can stimulate it or can facilitate its activity it turns a lot of these seemingly innocuous caffeine components into some pretty heavy hitting drug products for that matter.And so you talk about the issues with the energy drinks.
Most of the components that you find in most energy drinks are things like taurine and glucuronolactone and they may have a little bit of an effect, but for the most part, the big problem with energy drinks is one they have a lot of caffeine and two they're easy to drink, and particularly the shots.Okay.And thus the name, shot.Okay.And so when you consume caffeine in a shot that caffeine gets in your system very quickly and you'll feel the effects you know, you will have the five hour energy,.
You know, and so on and so forth.But the problem is is that people say oh, well, one of these is fine, you know, they're sold out there with the advils and whatever else of the world.Boom, you start hammering back three or four of those things and the next thing you know you're getting close to caffeine toxicity.And then a lot of these products are also marketed to be used in conjunction with vigorous exercise and so down in arkansas where i'm from when you start getting into the late summer and.
Football season is around the corner and you start getting into two a day practices in the heat, and a lot of these kids are taking red bull and monster and rock star and because they're easy to drink and they think that it's kind of like gatorade, but it's nothing like gatorade.And so then you've got a lot of this caffeine in your system and caffeine and vigorous exercise in the heat is a very bad combination.And so that's why you start to see, that's why the number of emergency room visits.
Related to caffeine since 1990 has increased by a factor of four or five.But there are a number of components that are inherent in a lot of natural caffeine sources that can stimulate the activity of the caffeine.But also there's some purposeful formulation.I think it is purposeful formulation with some of these components that are known to stimulate the activity of caffeine, and that's why you find them in a lot of products, particularly some of the unique energy drinks, but more so in a lot of these.
The Hard Lives of Britains Synthetic Marijuana Addicts
Spice just hits you like a truck, it just knocks you out.Whereas bud you just sit and chill.You know what i wish i could go back to my bud.Because you know what, spice, it's horrible.I woke up after the spice, with vomit all over my bed, and myself.I know a kid who died of it.Couldn't get his heart beating more.It was beating too fast, it just went and shook out.As the new government began making moves to ban all legal highs, we headed to manchester, where synthetic drugs like spice, and.
Other brands like vertex, pandora, and insane joker, are freely available to buy from news agents and places known as head shops.Although manufacturers state on the packets that they're not fit for human consumption, legal highs are used recreationally.And they make the press when students overdose on them.Most people thought it was a recreational drug, a party drug, something that you could, perhaps, dip in and out of.But actually, nobody really knows what they're made of part and what structure they have and how they impact on the body.
Although students with a support network tend to dip in and out of synthetic drugs.We wanted to meet a much more vulnerable group of people who can suffer from the affects of a real dependency on legal highs.All the clients that are presenting here are using spice.It's affecting the mental health, it's affecting the physical health, and it's a massive, massive problem.Manchester has more rough sleepers then anywhere else outside of london.Cuts to council services have left the city with 20 fewer emergency beds than there were five years ago.
And during that time, legal highs have become a crutch to many of the people who now live on the streets.I use it myself, and i use it because it takes the pain away.It's legal.What can i do i can sit here now, there could be 20 officers around me with guns and everything.As long as pull a bag of spice out and start rolling it, i can roll it.Nothing that anybody can do.I pull a bag of weed out and they'll all be on me like a car bonnet.
How might people go about trying to get hold of it once you can't go to a shop and buy it there's always gonna be some match level drug.There's already street dealers out there.Are you worried though that it might start criminalizing people yes, yes i've seen some bad you have got to look at this drug, it's bringing heroine addicts, i know a heroine addict that's a spice addict now.He takes spice like he used to take heroine every single day of the week.He doesn't took to heroine now,.
So that heroine a class a drug and the spice is bringing him off that.What is in this stuff it's amazing.The misuse of drugs act controls substances on the basis of their structure.The banned cannabinoid in weed is thc.Synthetic cannabis like spice mimics the effects of weed by replicating and slightly altering the chemical that gets people high.Legal high manufacturers design cannabinoids and constantly update the composition of their products, so that they remain within the law.But, these experiments can leave the users smoking a legal version of weed.
That can be a hundred times stronger.One of the few volunteer organizations that caters to manchester's homeless community is lifeshare, a charity that looks after young people seeking advice and accommodation.Where i've just come from is everywhere.It's everywhere.Yeah, it's everywhere.People are making thousands of pounds off that.In jail, yeah.And trust me i've seen some kids in wheelchairs.It's funny, yeah, but afterwards it's not.So more people just die.Pretty much most of our clients use the spice.I think the main reason that it's being used quite a lot, is it's cheap.
People that used to smoke cannabis, they're spending ten pound on cannabis.And they're getting two smokes out of it.They're spending five pound on a gram of spice.And it's going a lot further and it's a lot stronger as well, i believe.What i've noticed when it comes to manchester is the number of rough sleepers there are.Most of our clients now are homeless and will sleep here.Why is that well, realistically there's budget cuts to various services or whatever, and homelessness has been a major one.
We need more shelters and we need more hostels.Lifeshare is the first point of contact for people living on the streets, and currently sees over 100 clients.A regular member of their dropin clinic is titch.I've got a spliff there.Where do you sleep at night, titch car park up portland street.Are you waiting for a hostel when was the last time you had a spice hit about half 10, 11 o'clock this morning.How are you feeling right now like i want to kill someone.I want to go back into strangeways prison and do a 28 day detox.
But that would be pointless.Why would it be pointless going into strangeways because there's more spice in there than what's out on the streets.Inaudible you look like you're about to roll a spliff.Yeah, inaudible i forgotten a spliff this morning.That's about 40 spliffs right there in that one.I don't want it, but i'm in pain.I'm in that much pain.Where does it hurt my stomach, shooting pains down my leg, shooting pains up my spine.Pains in my neck and in my arm.Harmful if swallowed.
May cause respiratory irritation.Do you want a glass of water to drink have you ever seen any other drug like this this is supposed to be legal, but it has a sense of deterioration that you don't expect from crack.Crack cocaine, and then quickly, rapidly deteriorated, over a few weeks of using it.I've gone from that to this.Can you remember the first time you started spice in the summer seeing young people begging that would have never normally begged before and they're going begging for spice.Risking their accommodation and everything, cuz they're not going home.
To accommodation cuz they're off their faces on spice in the car parks.How much spice do you smoke six grams a day.Six grams a day yeah.And how much does that cost it's three for 20 pounds so you are looking at about 30 pounds or 40 pounds a day.I'd rather it be illegal because, do you know what yeah i'd rather blaze my bud.Look at me now yeah, right, i'm rattling, right, my head's all over, right, and i can't think straight.Now, if this was bud, don't get me wrong, i'd be sat here stressed,.
Judy's seen me stressed when i've not had bud, but i'm not like this, i'm not rattling.You know what, it's horrible.And it's the same irritability that you would associate with crack, but you're actually sometimes now showing physical withdrawal signs as well, which you usually associate with heroin.I mean some of the young people here describe the heart palpitating and really, really going really fast.They just will not take on board that how detrimental it's gonna be to their mental health, their longterm wellbeing.How did it make you feel.
The first time i had it yeah.It was actually pandora's box as well.Were you there we can do that.I think.I don't know! what are you doing with your legs and i was just waving my legs, laughing my ass off at every single thing.I don't know.You had a spliff about half an hour ago now.How are you feeling now i'm not as bad, a bit anxious but not too bad.I'm putting my full time into getting off spice, i know i can but.
I have to be away from being surrounded by it.At the moment the town has become a breeding ground for it.Everybody comes into town, they won't go home because they need to get spice.It's being in this situation on the streets, while everybody else is doing it, that i kind of find it hard to get away from it.Titch, do you see that your way out of spice, and being surrounded by spice culture is by getting a secure accommodation in a hostel yes, d'you know what.
I've said this from day one.I will stop smoking spice when i get in a hostel, right and the only reason, the reason is yeah, is because of the bud.I'd love to smoke my bud after this because i know yeah, my bud ain't making me unfit, it ain't making me drop, it ain't fucking my head up and that.Before meeting tim, johan realized that legal highs like spice were addictive.He's only gone a few hours without smoking it before showing signs of withdrawal.There's the rattling going now.
I wanted to find out from someone whose job it is to get people off drugs, if the legal status of a particular substance had any impact on whether people take it or not.There is a level of naivete around thinking that by making legal highs illegal, people will be less inclined to use them.If somebody is already in a situation of relative chaos in their life in general, it would be unlikely that we would see a significant impact in people using them.It's not necessarily gonna positively impact on the people who are using it,.
But it impacts on who's in charge of the supply and where the supply comes from.It's a public health issue.And what we wouldn't want to see is for the criminal aspect of that problem to be prioritized over the public health aspect.I think all services providing information, support, access for members of the public, we've had significant financial cuts, i think, over the last five years.And that's probably going to continue, so there'll be a 25 reduction in the overall spend on drugs and alcohol.He's one of the biggest spice heads in town.
I know two people who have died of it.At a city center soup kitchen, local health workers are dealing with spice casualties on a daily basis.The guy that we first came across on the wall, he was completely out of it, unconscious.We've been talking to lots of people about it.They say they've never seen a drug have as massive effects as legal highs do on people.No.We've gone from having no problems with it to now we're getting three or four people every night.We've had no training on it, obviously, when we did the training it wasn't there,.
Now we are starting to get training on it because there's so much out there, it's so bad.Outlawing something doesn't sort of change people's intention to do something.It doesn't no, but it becomes illegal more can be done about it.Same again, now i can smell it now.Yeah, me too.And it doesn't smell like weed, does it no.It is so much chemically related, that nobody really knows what's in it.It will knock you out and it will numb your senses to the elements and stuff.
This is why it's becoming a homeless phenomenon, it's because it numbs your senses and it makes you dull and it makes the elements not bother you.Later that night we went to find it.As we wandered the streets, it was hard to ignore the irony and the fact that spice was, to some degree, a problem of the government's own making.And there seemed to be a similarity between titch's cycle of satisfying his own addiction and the government's way of handling drugs.A sort of whacamole tactic that only serves as a temporary solution.
CNBC Safe Herbs Versus Toxic Pharma Drugs
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